Fuel Problem

[jmcleavy]

Just put my 180 back on the road, the fuel was quite low so went to garage to fill up.

Let the car running for a while as the battery needed some charge, however, after returning about 30 minutes later the car was chugging.

Now when i start it chuggs then eventually the engine stops, nothing happens when i put my foot on the acelerator.

Is this because the fuel had been so low and its sucked some crap through?

If so, will i need a new filter?

Where is best to source one?

Is it an easy job?

Cheers

[peterzs]

Think I read that you have to put quite a bit of fuel in the tank if its run low.

Don't know why it needs a few gallons, but if you haven't put in much they don't get the pressure.

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

[Dave ZS-X]

sounds odd, i always ran mine on absolute minimum on track and regularly after a session it would start to miss as the pump sucked a bit of air up, it was never a problem, i just filled to a 1/4 tank again for the next session and off i went.

[peterzs]

Be interesting to know how much went in when it was re-fulled.

[jmcleavy]

I put ?40 worth of fuel in, that took it to just over half full.

When i came back to the car after leaving it running it was revving quite high intermitantly then started chugging, i just assumed it had got too hot although the gauge was normal and turned it off.

Thought nothing more of it until i came back and started a couple of hours later.

I'm no mechanic but i dont understand why, when i put the pedal down to the floor nothing happens.

I'm stumped

[stamford]

Perhaps a sensor requires cleaning? Check these http://www.themgzs.co.uk/vb/showthread.php?t=13815

Might be one of the engines sensors causing this? You might well plug in a diagnostic reader to see if anything comes up. As for low fuel, mine has run as low as Dave has already mentioned with no ill effects, just a scavaging pump sound. My zed has, at times, been off the road for several months and all I did prior to starting was the prime the engine before starting (remove fuel relay and crank to ensure oil pressure) Does sound like the ecu is stopping the engine from running due to being given poor or no signals.

[tb steve]

i bet the battery needs charging up
i had this on mine it coursed all sorts of running probs it would start up and run rough,fans on all the time,re-charged the battery all fixed

[jmcleavy]

If its the engine sensors is that an expensive fix?

If its battery why would it run ok after being jumped off then suddenly cause this problem?

thanks for your help by the way fellas

[jmcleavy]

Just got home and put the fuel filter back on, it will now run without stopping but appears to be firing on only 2 cylinders.

New plugs or clean up the existing ones perhaps?

Thoughts?

[petet16]

Sticking injectors maybe, they may have become a bit gummed up from being unused for a while, if you can reach the injectors with a spanner give them a tap and see if things improve

[Bobdope2002]

rev the nipples off it :laugh:











no seriously dont do that :laugh: does sound as if sommats clogged up though how long was it off the road for??

[jmcleavy]

Only off road for a month mate, will try giving the injectors a tap

[Bobdope2002]

Only off road for a month mate, will try giving the injectors a tap

sounds strange tbh

theyre are people in here who have left em standing for months and theyve just started with a bump

Are you sure the fuel isnt dodgy??

[tb steve]

If its the engine sensors is that an expensive fix?

If its battery why would it run ok after being jumped off then suddenly cause this problem?

thanks for your help by the way fellas


this is going to sound silly but IF you battery does not have enough power in it the car cant charge up due to not enough power in battery to power the alternator and making the car run rough i also jumped mine off a 1.2 micra and it was ok for a little while
then it went funny again while helping someone out my car would run rough,fans was on,dash went all strange and could not drive it was hopping forward all due to lack of elec
try it hopefully its an easy fix for you

[stamford]

If the alternator is working as it should it will run with the battery disconnected. The battery is there to start the car, the alternator tops the battery up when running. A good alternator will give around 14v, less than this is no good.

I suggest looking at other causes and eliminating them one by one.

[jmcleavy]

Checked plugs, cleaned them off and put them back in, replaced fuel filter, fuel pump working.

Can't get at crankshaft sensor to check so running out of ideas.

Looks like i'm gonna have to call someone out to it.

[jmcleavy]

Been told this could be a cracked inlet manifold, is this an expensive job?

[stamford]

Are we talking about the alloy ones from head to plenum or the plenum as that can be called a manifold by some. If it is the alloy ones then they can be picked up on ebay second hand or from someone on here, cost will be in labour time, 2 hours should be enough to do that.

[jmcleavy]

Just been told that this will cost me around ?600 to ?700 to fix
Needs a new inlet manifold and the old one has been welded.
I am now offering this car up for spares or someone who has the time or inclination to work on the car.
I don?t have the knowledge to do this myself.
I can?t break the car as I have nowhere to keep it so anyone who wants it would need to take it as a job lot and as it is.
Other than the inlet manifold there are no issues, it?s in lovely condition, great tyres exhaust etc, it would make a great buy for someone.
Best reasonable cash offer will secure the car

I am located in Hull so obviously buyer will need to collect

Contact me via PM or 07949823089

[stamford]

Shame it has come to this. If you were nearer I would fix it for you, seems like you have been stitched up tbh there. Just wish I had the spare cash as I would buy that off you as a project if you are serious about getting rid.

[jmcleavy]

Serious mate, its a shame, not got the knowhow to do it. as i said best reasonable cash offer, not looking for anything stupid. Would rather it went to one of you guys than for scrap, will be a good car again for someone

[ramdonice]

where are you based mate as i would be willing to do the work for ya

[jmcleavy]

To far for you mate, in hull. just looking to get rid now. thanks anyway

[starfire039]

that sucks.

[peterzs]

Cant you get a s/h one off ebay and see if a local mobile mechanic will fit it for you.

Seems a shame to get rid, if you can get it going.

If not, all the best with selling it on.

[talkingcars]

Just been told that this will cost me around ?600 to ?700 to fix
Needs a new inlet manifold and the old one has been welded.
............

Who told you this?

Is the ?600 to ?700 for new parts and labour?
If a whole head gasket on a K4 can be done by a mobile mechanic for ?300 I can't see how changing a KV6 manifold (which has to be removed to reach the head gasket) can be this much.

It is a couple of hours work so would be about ?80 labour, that then leaves ?420 for parts!

?485 buys a complete brand new manifold with all the vis motors and I'd be suprised if it all needed replacing.

Why has the old one been welded?

[Maxfly]

I have a spare inlet manifold in the garage, no vis motors or purge valve. It has a slight, and I mean very slight rattle on the right hand side but I was not down on power when it was fitted to my car with working vis. Would do the job for ye, yours for ?20 delivered and it is a very easy job to change yourself following the good Mick did on here:)

[jmcleavy]

Does an inlet manifold have a sensor in it? they said this was broken but could not get into fit new one because the old one has been welded hence need for new one. is it really easy to fix?

[stamford]

Can you take a picture of the offending item and post it up? would make it easier to say for sure what needs to be done. Pretty sure you have been told a load of BS and it is repairable.

[petet16]

Does the KV6 have the fuel temp sensor in the inlet manifold.

It sounds like you've been given some dodgy info about welding sensors imo

[jmcleavy]

Just been told its needs a new pressure sensor/valve, they can't get to it because the current manifold hs been welded. therefore need new pressure sensor/valve and manifold. what now then guys?

[Bobdope2002]

Just been told its needs a new pressure sensor/valve, they can't get to it because the current manifold hs been welded. therefore need new pressure sensor/valve and manifold. what now then guys?

we need a piccy really with the area thats broken and a picture of the alleged weld

Sounds like the garage has tried fobbing you off because youve told em you have no idea whats needing doing

[stamford]

I can only think of the MAP sensor, which is external therefore a simple swap and the fuel pressure regulator, which is under the plenum. Can anyone local to you in Hull who is conversant with a 180 take a look and confirm this? This welded bit sounds like a red herring to me.

[jmcleavy]

Im happy to get new manifold cos they seem to be quite cheap on here but what about the sensor/valve does it come with manifold. can't get photo as its in workshop ans I'm not at work

[jmcleavy]

Nno one local stamford as far as i know

[stamford]

Will be hard to help with exact root of cause without seeing photographic evidence. If you can get something up it will help alot and hopefully we can do something to get this going again.

[Maxfly]

Will be hard to help with exact root of cause without seeing photographic evidence. If you can get something up it will help alot and hopefully we can do something to get this going again.

+1

Am trying to figure out what they think is welded?!?! The plastic inlet manifold or the metal inlet pipes?!?:)

[stamford]

Same here Gary, does sound odd, so much so I think someone is ducking the work perhaps? No idea as to why the alloy inlets would be welded, can't see it myself. Perhaps it is referring to plastic welding or bonding somewhere where it has affected the assembly of components on the vicinity?

[jmcleavy]

I think its been plastic welded

[stamford]

Getting closer! But not close enough ;) Still can't see what's been done to cause the problem. If the plenum has been welded then it sounds like it has been apart before. Maybe the fuel rail has been disturbed or the pressure regulator is playing up? Had this been plugged into a diagnostic at all?

[jmcleavy]

Sorry stamford, I'm trying to find out stuff for you but only got my phone to post replys so its a bit of a nightmare fella!

[stamford]

Okay, don't worry too much, every snippet of info will help. We'll get there eventually.

[jmcleavy]

Cheers fella

[jmcleavy]

Right, just talked to the guy, he says pressure sensor inside the inlet manifold has failed, can't get to it because the manifold has been plastc welded to fix a previous crack. That's the story guys, over to you

[stamford]

There isn't one inside! All sensors and vis units are external and accessable. That is the only plastic component that fits the description. Correct me if I am wrong here guys but the only parts connected to the plenum are:

Power vis unit-screwed in.
Balance vis unit-screwed in.
MAF sensor-screwed in.
Purge valve-screwed in.
Then throttle body with potentiometer and IAC valve screwed in place.
Other than that its push fit breather piping.
As for pressure sensor, lost me there bud unless it is the MAF sensor? But that's external.

[jmcleavy]

Wow, now I'm completely lost

[jmcleavy]

IIs there anything else that qould make it lose vaccum?

[stamford]

Is the diagnosis correct? Has the car been plugged into a diagnostic reader?

[jmcleavy]

I plugged one in and it came up with no error codes. i think these guys are guessing to be honest.

[jmcleavy]

To recap, car would rev and cough, when you put foot on pedal it would cut out. all plugs been changed and is better but still coughs, like there is air getting in

[stamford]

It certainly sounds like it.

[jmcleavy]

I'm at a loss with it then

[petet16]

That's certainly an odd one, the plastic plenum was plastic welded during manufacture I think, it has proved one of the stumbling blocks to repairing them ie how to effectively re-seal the unit afterwards.

The fact that it's been plastic welded to repair a crack suggests some one has tried to get in there before, but even if it hadn't had the crack repaired you still wouldn't be able to gain access inside it, and I'm pretty sure there's no sensor in there anyway.

[jmcleavy]

Now saying its the pressure sensor unit

[Bobdope2002]

they really havent a scooby doo what theyre talking about have they

go get the car back before they rob you blind and get us some piccys

The symptoms u described just are the same as i had yesterday when it had no fuel in it

TBH i think your best PM George (MGROVERPARTS on here i think he is) and ask him about it to see if hes had anything similar happen to him

hes very clued up on the KV6

Worth a try

[lawrence-zs180]

does it look like this?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MG-Rover-Manifold-Pressure-Sensor-ZS180-ZT-160-190-/250719873450#ht_500wt_922
Are they showing you what they think is the issue of are they just picking parts out of the sky?

[big_wasa]

If the plenum is cracked I have one you can have. It ratles but will get you back on the road.

The only way its cracked is if some one has tried to open it, maybe to stop it ratling to sell it on.

[Bobdope2002]

The only way its cracked is if some one has tried to open it, maybe to stop it ratling to sell it on.

Or the garage in question trying to change alleged non exsitant sensor and in the process have buggered it up???

[lawrence-zs180]

seems weird that its happened after it went low on fuel though..

[Captain Peanut]

I'm very green at this but you mentioned in a previous post that you couldn't get to the crank shaft sensor to check it, have the garage checked that now? Had one of these go on my old Omega and caused similar problems.

[Ljnoble1972]

i once had a similar issue with a MGZT V8 after i fitted an exhaust front pipe, after changing plugs checking sensors and spending a long time trying things it ended up being an issue with the fuel pump, although the pump was working perfectly it lost pressure as a clip came lose, the problem is as the pump was inside the tank it just leaked back into the tank, i know it sounds strange but it might be worth a look, i am not even 100% sure the set up is the same. If it is , just remove the pump and check the filter housing is still properly connected to the rest of the unit, i may be way off with this one but its worth a look .