Disappointing dyno result.
 

Went looking round for someone who can map the mods to the car in hopes of some power and no one could but the last guy said let's see what it can do now so I couldn't refuse lol.

I was so excited to see what the mods could do unmapped and get a baseline before a map is done.
Mods are as follows:
ITG Maxogen (recently serviced)
Piper 270 cams (pulleys not fitted yet they're in the drawer)
Janspeed manifolds
Decat
Piper mid and backbox.

I was expecting a decent result from the mods, the car feels good and seems to give newer stuff a go so I was optimistic.

The result:
http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/h...psbsyuxgfg.jpg


What have I been doing the last few years?
All for this?

I'm gutted guys.
I don't know what's going to happen next now where do I start?

So disappointing and disheartening.

At least it sounds alright
https://youtu.be/iQJ_n93HT_c
(Couldn't embed sorry)

Certainly not right. Even the rpm to final figures are different to mine, guess that's the cams doing that? However before mine was mapped it made 191 so quite where yours have gone is something else. You really need to get it mapped, should be seeing close to 210 with those mods.

What are the VIS like? :(

He pulled up a standard one that had been there and it was only 7bhp behind me. A fair bit behind in torque though late in the rev range where the cams kicked in, I was behind in the lower revs in torque and power.

I seem to be able to feel them kicking in fine as I put two new ones not too long ago but I will test them again soon, I'll have to get my name back on the list again

start with the vis, either they're not working or the cam timings way off

Unfortunately these things never go to plan

"I seem to be able to feel them kicking in fine as I put two new ones not too long ago but I will test them again soon, I'll have to get my name back on the list again"

If you and your mrs fancy a trip to blackpool you are more than welcome to pop round and use my ACR4 which will not only test the VIS motors but virtaully every other actuator and throw up any fault codes.

That aside, are you sure the mechnaic who fitted the cams knew what he was doing as didn't you say he couldn't work out how the verniers fitted hence why they are not on the car.

I will do, didn't think they could cause a big deficit
Didn't think about the timing! That would be easy (for someone else)
If it is that I could get the cams timed in.

I'm wondering if I even have the 270's fitted!

its really below 5k that things look bad, hence looking at vis.

just noticed...

no cat & no precat???

does it have a dodgy mil thingy???

No cat or precats no.

No dodgy MIL eliminator, I just clear the light with an old scanner every so often but it's often got the light on for a while before I do.

Ok the below five thing makes sense, thanks.
I do feel a kick at just before 4k so that seems to correlate a little on the graph.

question is, how happy is the ecu with that.

the ecu has adaption channels, have a think about the parameters the ecu sees and how it adapts to the sensor voltages it sees and adjusts for these as well as general engine wear.

personally I'd fit a 100cpi cat minimum sort the vis if they aren't working (and they don't look like they are) and reset the adaption channels.

I think you may be confusing that kick you feel just over 4k with the natural intake pulse length harmonics that happen, looking at the graph I'd say no working vis and its just pulse length your feeling.

Cam timing is out. Piper don't put the keyways in the same place as std cams

Sent from Drew @ Roverdose

What's the wheel power showing on the dyno? Wouldn't even bother looking at the corrected figures

Just seen this reply sorry Phil,
That could well be a plan at some point, I'll have to see what the calendar is like lol! Sounds like an awesome bit of kit!

I'm not so sure now on the mechanic! Thought he would be fine as a lot of people use them where I'm from but maybe he got it way wrong and it's out as a lot are saying and he's screwed it up!

Ok that sounds like something to look at then.

If those are different does that mean to use the standard timing marks or not?

I've never timed an engine before but is there any pictures or what should I be looking at to have a quick check.

I'm not sure tbh with you. That's the figures I got given so I don't know the wheel figures sorry.

interesting the point where hp and torque collide...

did you see the car rev out on the tacho?

was the guy watching the dyno screen revs to rev out or your tacho?

did the engine hit the rev limiter?

even the timing piper say they should be timed to is not really in the zone and not the sort of timing an expert would put on the motor.

most people time them up with the standard rover timing tools as so few people have exhaust side verniers.

the rover timing tools way of timing does not produce a graph like that, but I think the comment above may have stumbled across something interesting

Should be 5252?

It sounded like it hit the limiter each time to me, I didn't see the tach or the dyno screen tbh. Didn't know to keep a eye on it!


Just watched a couple of the vids back and it does seem sound like it revs out :/

yup, should be 5252, so if you re-align the the rev graph to 5252 and if the engine was not revved out...
Just a theory, may be way off...

https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5539/2...113d44a0_b.jpgskillenrev by mark stone, on Flickr

I'm not so sure now on the mechanic! Thought he would be fine as a lot of people use them where I'm from but maybe he got it way wrong and it's out as a lot are saying and he's screwed it up!

That's why I never use that garage heard many bad reports about them not being the best.

He took the belt job on at least :(:(
Won't be back there now anyway. Just need to find someone reputable in chester area now.


Have to wait to get home now before I can do more, not sure if I should check compression as well?

start with the easiest, simplest and most logical.

verify the dyno results first.

blink motorsport are up that way, they have had 2 similar spec cars on their hub dyno so you have comparitive results, around 172-4 at the hubs.

The graph won't cross in the rihht place as the scales on torque and power aren't the same

Sent from Drew @ Roverdose

And no it won't be correct on std timing marks.

Sent from Drew @ Roverdose

well spotted.

certainly not, and it will still be off on pipers figures, but timed up as standard wouldn't produce a torque curve like that, so I'd go back to vis motors as first check.

Which begs the question, what is the correct way to time the pipers for optimal performance? Mine are just on factory pulleys timed using the proper tools.

http://sharkwerks.com/forum_photos/3...m-timing-2.JPG

like this

I can imagine with the engine in the car that the rear bank will be difficult to time like this!

I'll check the vis motors as soon as I can, not sure when it will be though :/

Or I could just stick some fresh ones in and be done with it and repair mine as a spare set.

Timing wise I'll be best getting it done soon and I can then see if I can get it done maybe at the blink place :)

Hopefully it's an easy job to get me running spot on!
I guess I'll then see a noticable improvement in performance if it can all be rectified! :)

How do these results stack up against staccatos (mine) dyno. Don't the cars share similar mods?

http://forums.xpowerforums.com/showthread.php?t=42293

a typical torque shape, the vis at 3k & 4k clearly visible and the way the torque tails off. the usual gulps at vis opening in the afr too!

https://c6.staticflickr.com/6/5781/2...66f82ea7_b.jpgdyno by mark stone, on Flickr

Oh yeah can see those peaks there with nothing to compare to on my graph.

How much are vis motors going for?
Easy fix? I'm handy with a soldering iron.

Might well get myself across to those guys :)

does pete t16 refurb them with new circuit boards?? if so, i'd get a pair of them

So I can hear a fast rattle that comes on around 3k for a thousand (ish) revs

I'm imagining that is the plenum? Please tell me it's not the plenum.

most rattles on a rover are just down to p1ss poor tolerances.

even if the plenum rattles a little, as long as everything is attached and still operates smoothly I wouldn't worry, your problem is the vis motors and/or seized balanced flap rather than play in the ball & knuckles

Cool thanks, I'm still waiting for a response from peteT16 on the motors just thought it may be another thing in the way!

Didn't know the balance flap could stick. Can I throw some carb cleaner through to unstick?

Had mine done in Yeovil and got 194. Air filter mod de cat and stainless exhaust.

Had scooby done in January after a few mods and got 317bhp BUT the owner of the rolling road noticed that the inlet air temp blasting the front wasn't set correctly and stated we should be more like 330bhp just due to that. She don't half pop and bang too but ticks over silky smooth and quiet. A bit of a sleeper tbh.

sometimes the plastic becomes distorted and need a file to correct

Jesus, the damn thing is a bloody nightmare.

Unless you have a front mount intercooler you will always get get high intake temps on a Scooby easiest way to sort that problem is to buy a Evolution :p .... Only having a laugh there btw

Can't get a nice Evo for £1700 though. Plus servicing. Ooooooooh!

The temp of the fan that they blow air in was wrong I believe? Still 317bhp was nice as we were only hoping to break 300